Interviews: How to Make Strong Connection

[00:00:03] Welcome to the Quick Take Podcast, the show where you get targeted advice and coaching for executives by executives. I'm Susie Tomenchok.

[00:00:12] And I'm James Capps. Give us 15 minutes and we'll give you three secrets to address the complex topic of issues that are challenging executives like you today.

[00:00:23] Hey, Quicksters. Welcome. I'm your host, Susie, along with James. How are you?

[00:00:27] Good. I'm really good. It's starting to be winter. One of my favorite seasons. It's my favorite wardrobe season.

[00:00:33] I'll give you that. I really love the fall. So, but you know.

[00:00:37] Well, you're an autumn. That's why.

[00:00:39] Yes. So, I met with my friend Stacy yesterday and we were having coffee and we just chat and I did just a catch up thing. But she said, hey, can you give me some advice?

[00:00:51] She had recently gotten let go and she's now in the throes. She hasn't been in interview mode for now, like literally years because she's been at the company.

[00:01:03] Yeah. For a long time. And she's like, I don't even know how to do it. What questions are they going to ask?

[00:01:11] But it was really interesting because I think that there was a missing component about how do you, you get yourself ready.

[00:01:18] But what about that person on the other side? How do you make that best impression? It's not necessarily just the answer that they're looking for, but there's more to it.

[00:01:29] So, it was a really interesting discussion because she just is so insecure and so like focused on, it's almost like she has a finite mindset because she's so worried about finding a job that she can't get out of her own way.

[00:01:43] Well, it's hard when you haven't done this for a while.

[00:01:45] Yeah.

[00:01:45] Or if you just don't, you know, we always joke that you don't want to be good at interviewing.

[00:01:51] Like you don't want to be good at having a wedding.

[00:01:53] But you also, you know, you do as a human basically sell yourself, if you will, and promote yourself. And that's what an interview is. And if you don't do a lot of that in your role and, you know, Stacy, was that her name? She hasn't had the need to do that. And maybe she was in a comfortable role where her value is known because of her position. And so to have to go back and do that again, that's really hard.

[00:02:19] And especially at her level, like she doesn't feel like she should have to do that, but it's so important. And I said, I was going to ask you and then call her and give her some tips on what she needs to do because it's tomorrow.

[00:02:32] Oh gosh. Yeah, we should do that. And, you know, it's funny. Coincidentally, I read a really great Harvard Business Review article about that very thing about, you know, essentially how do you ensure that you make an impression during an interview?

[00:02:46] And the four real things that you should do as a candidate, thinking about that process and thinking about how you can, you know, basically back to your point, you know, you want to answer the questions, but there's some other items that you want to really think about before the interview to make sure that you do the best you can.

[00:03:05] You know, what scares me is there's four and that's not our formula.

[00:03:09] I don't know what you're going to do.

[00:03:10] I could probably come up with nine to be honest with you, but I think that at the end of the day, there's just so many different ways to do this well.

[00:03:17] And I think that, I think it's really key that, that people, you know, give it some thought.

[00:03:21] What you're saying is there's the questions and there's the interview, but there's also the underlining human to human connection.

[00:03:29] Yes. And I think the best, let me get to the first one, which is how do you do that?

[00:03:33] How do you create that human to human connection?

[00:03:35] You've, we talk about it all the time on the show.

[00:03:37] You have to be your authentic self.

[00:03:39] Yep.

[00:03:40] Right. So don't go into that interview trying to be maybe an extrovert or saying, talking too much or just don't, you know, if you think I need to be a very, you know, math oriented person for this interview and try to, you know, talk about math a lot.

[00:03:55] A, you probably shouldn't get that job. It would be horrible, but B, you know, you want to be genuine to yourself.

[00:04:01] So when you are authentic, when you can be comfortable, you are going to be so much better.

[00:04:07] And which I think here's the theme to our entire conversation, you will be able to make a better connection with that person because you are yourself.

[00:04:16] It's very easy to see when somebody is, is not being who they are.

[00:04:20] Sometimes it comes off as nerves, but generally speaking over a good hour interview, you're, it's going to become self-evident that you're not, you know, trying to be your genuine self.

[00:04:29] And I think that that's not great.

[00:04:31] I think what happens when you, you're not yourself is you pick different words that you normally do and you don't feel comfortable.

[00:04:37] Well, even though to your point, I mean, research does show this too, is it's building that trust.

[00:04:42] And when you don't feel sure-footed in where you are, the other person's going to sense that and you're not going to be build, building this.

[00:04:51] They're going to think you're inauthentic.

[00:04:53] You're not being honest to me.

[00:04:54] Well, I love your example was really a good one.

[00:04:57] You know, simply just using words that you don't usually use.

[00:05:00] It's obvious sometimes.

[00:05:02] And I think you should be thoughtful.

[00:05:03] Thoughtful.

[00:05:04] Again, a lot of this is about being thoughtful, but you know, be your, be your genuine and unauthentic style.

[00:05:11] All right.

[00:05:11] What's the second one?

[00:05:12] The next one really is interestingly about body language.

[00:05:16] I think that being kind of builds on the, the, the second one, your genuine self.

[00:05:21] You want to be thoughtful about your body language.

[00:05:23] You want to understand your tendencies.

[00:05:25] If no, obviously you're trying to create a connection.

[00:05:29] And if your tendency, your genuine self is not to look somebody in the eye, you may need to work on that.

[00:05:34] The connection is important.

[00:05:35] Eye contact.

[00:05:36] I know people who are, will talk with their hands so much that they have hit other people while speaking.

[00:05:42] And you, you need to be thinking about how do you use your hands, facial expressions, be yourself, but also be thoughtful about the way that you manage your body in that conversation.

[00:05:51] It actually influence research shows that showing your hands builds trust.

[00:05:57] And it's not like you want to be fictitious.

[00:05:59] If you're, you're not a person that uses your hands to talk, like you don't want to look.

[00:06:03] Oh yeah.

[00:06:04] It's not a mime.

[00:06:05] They're right here.

[00:06:05] Like you're showing the cops.

[00:06:07] My hands are right up.

[00:06:08] Keep your hands.

[00:06:09] You can see them.

[00:06:10] I'm good.

[00:06:11] But doing that.

[00:06:11] And another one, if you're not comfortable looking somebody in the eye, look at the bridge of their nose.

[00:06:16] If that makes you uncomfortable and they don't know where, like they just, as long as you're like right there.

[00:06:22] Yeah.

[00:06:22] But if that gets in your way that you're like, oh my gosh, I'm looking right at their eye.

[00:06:27] Cause sometimes that can be overwhelming.

[00:06:29] Just, but just focus on, and you know what that can do?

[00:06:32] It can make you really present in the moment so that you're not distracted about with the thoughts in your head.

[00:06:38] Exactly right.

[00:06:39] That's a great one.

[00:06:40] Yeah.

[00:06:40] Again, uh, making sure that you're aware of your body language.

[00:06:43] Interview will pick up on that.

[00:06:45] Be thoughtful in the way that you do it.

[00:06:46] You didn't know I was going to add so much value to all your tips.

[00:06:50] You're just unexpected by.

[00:06:52] You always add value.

[00:06:53] Are you kidding me?

[00:06:54] You guys don't see the work that goes into this meeting.

[00:06:56] It's all about Susie filling my brain with stuff.

[00:06:59] But the third one I think is, this is the thing that I do the most actually when I have an interview.

[00:07:05] And, and it's really about making sure that I'm feeling comfortable in that interview.

[00:07:11] And so it's about being strategic and doing the pre-work.

[00:07:14] Right.

[00:07:14] And so that means researching the interviewer, making sure you understand what the conversation

[00:07:19] will be.

[00:07:20] Be an active listener.

[00:07:22] Act thoughtfully.

[00:07:24] Answer the questions well.

[00:07:25] And so this is, these are strategic things you're doing.

[00:07:27] So it is about the way that you behave.

[00:07:31] And I think you, you want to go into the meeting knowing that you need to do this.

[00:07:35] I think that oftentimes it's easy to assume you just need to show up, but the interviews

[00:07:41] that really matter on the interviews that you do a really good job at are the ones that

[00:07:46] you prep for.

[00:07:46] Could agree more.

[00:07:47] And, you know, a fundamental principle of negotiation is prepare.

[00:07:52] And what that does is it allows you to be even more mindful in the moment because you have

[00:07:57] a plan.

[00:07:57] And you know a little bit about the environment, the person, the company.

[00:08:02] It gives you questions you can ask.

[00:08:05] It really helps make sure that you're there.

[00:08:08] And then that translates to the other person that you care, that you want to be here, that

[00:08:13] you are present.

[00:08:14] I mean, they're really looking for somebody that is going to not only be easy to work with,

[00:08:20] but who is connected and who does that well.

[00:08:23] You know, one of the great analogies or great related stories to this is when I see people

[00:08:29] who publicly speak that I think do a great job, the people who just kind of roll up and

[00:08:35] get in front of an audience and crush it.

[00:08:37] I would almost argue that 95% of the people that you, that crush it have practiced an enormous

[00:08:43] number of times.

[00:08:44] Practice makes perfect.

[00:08:46] And I know that's a tried phrase, but when it comes to this kind of thing, it matters.

[00:08:50] Public speaking, even that small amount of effort and the people who look like they make

[00:08:55] it so simple and easy, it's because they practiced.

[00:08:58] So preparation for an interview matters.

[00:09:02] I like to have notes.

[00:09:04] I like to practice my pitch and just those things give you the level of confidence that

[00:09:08] help you create the connection.

[00:09:09] I also like to say it out loud.

[00:09:12] And it's really interesting because when Stacey and I were talking about this, she was like,

[00:09:17] you know what?

[00:09:17] I've, I'm, I'm like, I should know how to interview.

[00:09:20] I, I've, I have all this experience as an executive, but it's like, she still needs to

[00:09:26] go back to the basics and just really make sure she's showing up well.

[00:09:31] And it's so like, you get to a certain point.

[00:09:33] You're like, I don't need to read that one-on-one on interviewing, but it is so important.

[00:09:38] And practice, say it out loud, do it with somebody else.

[00:09:42] Make sure that what, how you're selling yourself, how you're pitching yourself, how you're framing

[00:09:46] your value is really, really ready.

[00:09:50] I think that's so important.

[00:09:51] And I think doing that work, you know, just helps you make that connection that much better.

[00:09:55] Absolutely.

[00:09:56] So what's the four?

[00:09:57] Famous four, I think is the wild card in all this is you kind of need to, if you're going

[00:10:02] to be present and you are going to be your genuine self and you're going to be aware of

[00:10:07] your body language and try to make that connection, you also have to be ready for chaos, right?

[00:10:12] So a good interview, be ready for the cat jumping in front of your monitor, be ready for the internet

[00:10:18] to fail.

[00:10:20] Just have a plan, which you can revert to.

[00:10:23] Honestly, I find it very interesting when I'm interviewing a candidate and things go

[00:10:28] south to see how they behave, right?

[00:10:30] Because like, that's a really interesting part of the job.

[00:10:33] And frankly, if you can't handle the fact that your, your camera isn't working in a very

[00:10:39] casual and very simple way, then it probably doesn't bode well for you in other situations.

[00:10:44] So just think through the fact that certain things may go wrong and just be prepared for

[00:10:48] that because then you can respond in a really professional way.

[00:10:52] And again, make that comic connection.

[00:10:54] You know, there's a great meme out there about, I think a guy is they're doing a video conference

[00:10:59] and one guy stands up and accidentally shows that he's wearing shorts and he kind of panics.

[00:11:03] And the other guy stands up and shows that he's wearing shorts.

[00:11:05] And so then I guarantee that guy got that job.

[00:11:08] Creating that connection is key.

[00:11:10] And being ready for chaos is a good way to help you prepare for that.

[00:11:14] So I'll say one really important thing to always consider is, well, if you get there,

[00:11:18] they go, I only have 15 minutes or like, what if they have to leave or they get distracted?

[00:11:22] What could happen on the other side and how are you going to handle that?

[00:11:25] So that you have, you've kind of rehearsed what you're going to do in that situation.

[00:11:29] And so good.

[00:11:30] All right.

[00:11:30] So what are the, what are the tips?

[00:11:32] No, first one is always know your style and be your genuine self, right?

[00:11:37] Adapt accordingly, but make sure that you are yourself.

[00:11:40] So you're more comfortable and you're more present.

[00:11:42] Second, leverage your natural body language.

[00:11:45] Actually, you know, no.

[00:11:47] And one thing that I'll mention is like, I talk with my hands, but in a video, I actually

[00:11:51] bring my hands up because otherwise they're down here and you don't see them.

[00:11:54] So it is kind of a weird thing, but I'm adjusting and knowing my body language and using that

[00:11:59] to create a connection.

[00:12:00] And then think about the things that you need to do to make the connection even deeper.

[00:12:04] Prep for the meeting, you know, make eye contact, asking thoughtful questions,

[00:12:08] create that strategic, strategically create that connection.

[00:12:12] And then finally, of course, you know, always go and do that and expecting the unexpected.

[00:12:17] So you can be the most effective you can.

[00:12:20] The hour interview that turns into 15 minutes, you want to still crush it.

[00:12:23] Hang on.

[00:12:24] I've got to call Stacey right now.

[00:12:25] I'm going to get to her.

[00:12:26] Well, thanks.

[00:12:27] This was really helpful.

[00:12:28] Stacey, thanks you too.

[00:12:29] Perfect.

[00:12:30] So tell me about some feedback that you got and at first didn't want to accept it, but

[00:12:41] it ended up being something that really stuck with you and really helped you.

[00:12:45] You know, I think the feedback of regarding my listening skills has always been something

[00:12:52] that has been important.

[00:12:54] And mostly through my, you know, I get excited about topics and I really like having conversations

[00:13:03] with people where everybody's stepping over each other and interrupting each other and building,

[00:13:08] building, building that dialogue.

[00:13:09] But that's not everybody.

[00:13:11] And so many times I get in that mode and I've been coached or gotten feedback that, you know,

[00:13:20] not everybody's going to keep up or that sounds more Machiavellian than I meant it to be, but

[00:13:25] not everybody's going to want to play that game or many people may feel overwhelmed.

[00:13:30] And so I have to.

[00:13:32] The feedback I enjoy getting and I'm happy to hear is, you know, helping me improve my

[00:13:37] listening skills and ensuring people are hurt.

[00:13:40] I love it.

[00:13:41] I love it.

[00:13:45] Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Quick Take, where we talk about the questions

[00:13:49] that are on the minds of executives everywhere.

[00:13:51] Connect with us and share what's on your mind.

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[00:13:59] All the links you really need are in the show notes.